The "Not a Project" CB450DX (project log + pics)

CB450DX

CB450DX

Veteran Member
Joined
Jun 1, 2024
Total Posts
150
Total likes
205
Location
Curitiba, Brazil
I promised myself it wasn't a project...
It's a project. And a Japanese 360 twin of a project. Could've not picked a more specific one if I wanted to (there was a Yamaha TDM 850 for the same price though.......)

Pictures will be at the end of the post, check them out!

After my first post (check it out for the whole story, and all the plans that fell through lol):
Click here (It's just another thread on the forum)

Here's a couple of things that happened:
-Finally learned to centerstand. It's so freaking easy once you know how to. I just put it down and keep my shoe on it, lean the bike to the right side till it touches the center-stand, and pull it up.
-Tested battery voltages while bike was running, pretty healthy, 13~13.6v.
-Had to tighten some of the turn signals, they would just randomly stop working, probably due to grounding to the frame. Tightened the nuts, no issues since.
-Ended up liking the original bars, quite a lot shoutout to @LongDistanceRider for suggesting I keep them and try them out.
-Put 2 brand new NGK spark plugs on it. DP9EA-9. (older bikes use D8EA gapped to .6~.7mm)
-Rode almost 300kms with her, mostly late evenings and dawn rides to and from my girlfriend, all chilling and with no one in the streets. Stretched her 3rd gear towards 100km/h once on a empty street that was being built in the back of my home, no issues. Haven't got my full license yet, so I'm pretty proud of what I rode so far and how comfortable I feel with her.
-Did valve clearances. Some were in spec, some were not. Everything looked pretty good and bathed in oil though, good sign.
-Took her to my trusted mechanic to take out the brake bleeding screws, they were all in various states of "bad" and I could not for the life of me get the 2 front ones out. Got 3 new original Honda ones. All good, new DOT4 fluid as well. Mechanic did let me know that he was hearing quite a bit of timing chain noise, which after hearing another 450 he had on the shop with the same exhaust as mine, I definitely agreed.
-Did the tensioner, noise was reduced a bit, but was still present.
-Felt my right leg hurting after a few hours of riding and realised that the "rider" portion of the seat is kind of worn out, while the passenger part doesn't seem like it was ever used lol. I'll either replace the foam or buy a new seat (which might be cheaper, believe it or not), I don't think my current one is original anyway.
-Removed the grill around the cylinder and head - This particular year doesn't have it, and they weigh quite a bit, they also go for quite a lot of money, so I'm storing it in case I ever need more money to fix her. On some pics I still have them on so you can compare how they look (I'm not too proud of my polishing on the head fins, I'll work on that when it's running)
-Got a CBX200 Strada float for the tank which works half of the time, but hey, better than showing I have no gas all the time - Had a small leak on it, cleaned it all up, checked all cables, shouldn't be any damage. Only noticed the leak when I filled the tank up though, so I had to run like 300m home from the gas station running the risk of becoming The Ghostrider if a spark flew out. Thankfully, nothing happened. I did a small scratch on the tank though which annoyed me a lot, I waited for a month for the tank to get painted... But luckily, it's hidden by the seat.

And then, she decided to break down on me.

One day after the gas leaked and after cleaning everything, I rode her for about 1km going to a supermarket, did my stuff in less than 15 mins, got on the bike again, ran for less than a kilometer, engine got rough and weird all of a sudden, she struggled to keep on, throttle kept her alive but BARELY, then she died. Luckily at a redlight.
I noted some weird noises when I tried to start it immediately, but no "valve hitting piston" sounds though. To my untrained ears, felt like the ignition was kinda bad and all over the place. Pushed her to the side, I was less than 100m from my mechanic but... It was a sunday. It just had to be. Plus, I also had a 4 pack of toilet paper on the bike as my gf asked me to buy for her and I was going to a BBQ at her place (weird thing to bring to a BBQ but I don't make the rules). Was also wearing a shirt that had "old bike lifestyle" written on the back which felt very appropriate.
Pushed her to the side, took the seat out, checked connections, tried to start her, no deal. Was running fine just before it, even doing some decelerating pops around 3000rpm as she always did.

Pushed her home for about 1.5km, then a guy stopped to help me and strapped a rope. Got her home. Tried to start her at home, she made a pop at the exhaust (which only happened before when I tried to start her forgetting to turn the ignition on and then turned it on). Was very careful to note if the engine didn't spin freely or if it made any different sounds, it sounded 100% normal, just didn't want to start. Did show some promise a time or another but nada, my uncle also cranked it quite a lot thinking it was choked while I disagreed but what do I know. At least that proved the starter and battery are in very good shape.

So, I started checking stuff:
-Checked for spark on both plugs and on both cables. Left spark plug was wet (probable reason is explained on "carbs" down below), but both plugs sparked. To me, it looked like a very healthy spark but I've also worked with a friend on a Beetle that had a faulty ignition coil that would spark pretty good outside but the engine would simply not run.
-Compression seemed fine from both the exhausts and plugging my finger on the spark plug hole (rudimentary tools, I admit, but I had done that test when I bought her as well and it felt at the very least close)
-Gas was good, I'm running premium gas (Podium as it's called around here, still has about 25% ethanol [2% less than the 27% that's on normal gas], but has a higher octane value and some additives, most people around here who run carbureted stuff only run their engines on it so I feel pretty safe. I also took a liter of gas out of the tank and put it in my 2 stroke 66cc (along with oil, of course) and it ran fine, much more sensitive engine imo.

And then I accepted this was going to be another month without the bike. So I might as well check everything I could.

Ignition Coil
My ignition coil and CDI are still original, which meant I could get a multimeter and check their values against those of the service manual, so I bought a multimeter (for the 5th time in my life, I think). Ignition coil was the first thing that was coming to my mind so I checked it:
-Primary circuit was a little bit out of spec, but this could be due to my multimeter not being the best.
-Secondary circuit should be 8k ohms to 8.8k ohms... Tested and... 15~16k ohms. Damn it. So that needs to be replaced.

Bought a new one from a known good brand, already installed it on the bike, the carbs were already off the bike so I haven't tested it yet. My mechanic did let me know he has a good one on the shop but it was cheap so I bought one anyway.

Carbs.
Took out the carbs. I knew they weren't "quite perfect" but they ran fine, and didn't really leak more than a few drops if I left the petcock on for long periods not riding.
Well. Busted. It was a bit dirty but only from what appeared to be old gas residue, easily cleaned with brush and WD-40 (truly does everything).
The left carb had the float completely down, no spring action whatsoever, even if the spring needle had it.
The right carb had the float at almost the right height, but it had clearly been serviced before and a new seat for the float needle had been inserted... Which cracked its walls.
They also had clearly different parts, a float had a brand, the other one didn't, the pins were made from completely different materials, a mess all around.
Luckily, on both carbs the jets and everything else were not clogged or anything, they certainly didn't look new, but they were all good and 100%. Still sprayed compressed air and a bit of WD-40 through them to be sure.

When I took out the carbs, I also realized that she was missing the right side engine mount.... Had to go across city to find a destroyed CB400 to take it out of her. Felt bad for the other bike, but one must die so another can live. Still absolutely mad at the previous owner for BS like this (but then again, he knows absolutely nothing about bikes it seems, I feel bad for his CB750K4) - I still haven't put the engine mount in place as not having it there helps quite a lot with removing and placing the carbs (especially with the cables). Will do it before I get the bike running and take it to the mechanic though.

I could try to just rebuild it with a rebuild kit (there's a known good brand) but I decided to just go full-on restoration and took them to a carburetor shop. It cost 1/10 of what I paid for the entire bike, but the 450 my mechanic had at the shop had its carburetor go through their full restoration and it looked brand-new. I figured that would be the best starting point for me so I did it. Took them to the shop yesterday. Will probably get them next week (have a wisdom teeth surgery this week as well so it wouldn't work anyway)
I'll post a couple of pics from the restored carb on the pics as well.

Cam/Timing chain.
I didn't inspect the chain when I did the valve clearances adjustment, which was a dumb mistake, so I took the head cap off to inspect it. Well... Definitely needs a replacement. not really lot of vertical movement, but it can jiggle quite a bit to the sides on the sprocket. Sent the video to the mechanic, he agreed that it needs a replacement.
Called my mechanic, we settled on a value to open the whole thing and change it. Seriously thought about investing the money on tools and do it myself, all I'd really need is a torquimeter (for everything) + angle torquimeter (for the big screws) but since I have a few things coming up on the next few months, plus girlfriend things, I decided against it. And if I had to pull the engine from the frame, which I guess I would have to, that'd be a nightmare.
Bought a DiD chain (made in Brazil though, the japanese ones costs almost twice), new tensioner and guide as well. But all of this will have to wait for the carburetor.
Well, since it's going to be opened anyway, oil + filter change, I also want to do/learn to do the tensioner for the balancer chain on the right side of the engine.
So... What's left to do, besides waiting?
Need to check the CDI but really don't feel like it right now. I did find original new Honda CDIs but not many still left to be sold, and it's not cheap... So I might try to check my CDI before I go to surgery. Let me know if you guys have any tips or if this has any big chance of being CDI-related.
Also, found new original Honda cams... Same price as the CDI... Thinking about it.
I also learned that Isopropyl Alcohol absolutely destroys the chrome polishing on the radiator side covers... I have no f@#&^n idea why.

All in all, I can still appreciate her at my garage at least, much better than when the gas tank was being painted and it did not look like a bike. If I ever have an issue with it again, I'm buying a plastic gas tank and putting it on it (there's a few being sold, same size and looks of the original, just... plastic, at least it doesn't rust)

Now, for the pics. Enjoy!

https://imgur.com/a/f8H6iaz

Forgot to post the oil change pic:
https://imgur.com/ae3ZQrh
 
Last edited:
Were you able to find OEM jets and screws? I'm curious what's been done with all the old brass parts they removed.
 
Might check Import Duties for a CDI shipped from the US. Frank, aka member Maarakate, makes new CDI's that are exact copies with higher grade components.
 
EzPete said:
Were you able to find OEM jets and screws? I'm curious what's been done with all the old brass parts they removed.
Click to expand...
We have a decent local brand here called "Siverst" which are one of the known-good in the community (we still try to only replace what absolutely needs to be, as always), I used a few of their jets on a 150cc carburetor and they were pretty nicely made, bike is still running on those same jets, about 3.5y later? Something like that. Still pretty sure it's chinese made though, and I don't think the carb shops use their kits.
I believe that for the brass parts and that sort of deal they either recoat it or have custom made. When I visited the shop they had just walls and walls of carburetor parts and that sort of thing (like more than 3 walls). They also do quite a lot of CNC/milling/etc on there so every tolerance is checked with a micrometer (and a weird laser thing, some pretty advanced stuff I think).

I believe I also saw a few old Keyster repair kits laying around on there, which around here receive VERY high praise IF they are original and old stock. I should've asked for this when I went there, but I straight-up asked for the full restoration service as it was what was done to the carb from the other CB450 from my mechanic. I'm sure they don't use "standard" repair kits as they did replace the plastic cap that stays on the diaphragm, which is one of the parts that I could not find anywhere to buy for the life of me and I looked at every single possible brand (mine was cracked).

I was going to ask for my old stuff to be brought back as well but I ended up not being the one who picked up the carb so that went out the window (working from home aka working all the god damn time, ended up on a meeting when I was supposed to go pick it up, girlfriend thankfully was close by)

Other than that, saw a few 1930's carburetors getting re-done when I dropped mine there, some other old american weird gas-guggling stuff, even some classic carbs like the 2E / 3E that were very popular around here and about 30 beetle/vw air cooled carbs as well, good old H30/Pic 30s, not exaggerating about the quantity btw (we have adapters to fit these carbs into literally ANY car out there on the road right now)
LongDistanceRider said:
Might check Import Duties for a CDI shipped from the US. Frank, aka member Maarakate, makes new CDI's that are exact copies with higher grade components.
Click to expand...
I've checked and my CDI seems to still be going strong. I will keep that in mind though, the original CDI over here would cost me around $100 converting to U$D so it might even be financially viable lol. That said, it's all good, more details below.

Well, I mounted the carbs and it still did not fire. It would fire a bit, stay on for maybe 3~4 seconds at 2/4 throttle, but did not sound healthy or good, but was turning just fine when not firing though. Thinking back now, it sounded exactly how it was sounding when it went bad and stopped running.

So I went with my guts, and decided to start checking electronics and wiring, went straight for the CDI with my multimeter, after 2~3 tests that were within spec, I just decided to remove the head cap again and take a look. And there it was, the reason of all my troubles: A broken tensioner.

https://imgur.com/a/aij1Z4d

This thing was raised up from the head to the point where I could see its "hook" (shouldn't be a hook) coming out of the head. Now, I swear to god when I initially parked the bike I checked the head and cam chain but I did not see this, I even went back and saw the videos and confirmed it was still in place. WTF.

I think my engine should be fine since it's not making any bad noises when turning. Doesn't fire happily, but I reckon I really shouldn't expect it to do that.
I already had bought a new tensioner, guide and timing chain anyway, so this only complicates the "getting it to the mechanic" part. Guess I'll be loading it into someone's truck.

I'll take it to the mechanic on Monday to split the cases and see what we find.

It'll probably be fine.

...Or....I might have just destroyed my valves and pistons (and god knows what else) to the point where it might be more financially viable to buy a CB500 twin motor and put it on the frame. Maybe even a modern CB500F (sacrilegious, I know, sorry). I also don't know the total mileage of my engine so there might be surprises on that side as well, but I'm hopeful. Well, if push comes to shove, my bike doesn't even have the engine number registered on its document, so if I ever want to put another engine in, shouldn't be too expensive or bureaucratic, document-wise.
 
CB450DX said:
it might be more financially viable to buy a CB500 twin motor and put it on the frame. Maybe even a modern CB500F (sacrilegious, I know, sorry). I also don't know the total mileage of my engine so there might be surprises on that side as well, but I'm hopeful. Well, if push comes to shove, my bike doesn't even have the engine number registered on its document, so if I ever want to put another engine in, shouldn't be too expensive or bureaucratic, document-wise.
Click to expand...
The CB500T engine is very differently shaped than your engine so that's not a good fit easily, if at all. Can't speak to the modern CB500F engine but my guess would be the same. Many states here in the US do not record the engine number on the title for our bikes so that does make things easier though.
 
The 450 tensioning blade fits in a holder and can be replaced w/o splitting the case, 400 engines require case splitting. No need to replace the tensioner itself unless it's sticking instead of sliding.
 
Man, I swear to god I had typed a reply days ago but I think I just never clicked Post...
ancientdad said:
The CB500T engine is very differently shaped than your engine so that's not a good fit easily, if at all. Can't speak to the modern CB500F engine but my guess would be the same. Many states here in the US do not record the engine number on the title for our bikes so that does make things easier though.
Click to expand...
For sure. I was initially thinking of the CB500 from the 90's ~ early 00's, but that would really be a stretch since the engine is not made to be a stressed member of the frame, so it'd require a lot of frame modifications (to be fair, I think any engine would, but ehhh), it sold pretty well over here so it's easy to find on crashed/retired bikes, but not as easy as the modern CB500 engine, which for some reason is quite easy to find on crashed bikes (it's already been selling for a couple of years here as well). XT600 engine was another option that I thought about but then again the fact that it has the frame as an oil tank probably wouldn't work (and I heard a bit about electric issues with it). I don't see many options other these that so I'm still banking on keeping this engine, in fact, news about that below.

Fun random fact: a well known mod to the CB400/450's over here is to put the CB500 (90's ~ 00's) carburetors on them and use two LEFT admission boots from the Yamaha Tenere 600 (XT600Z). The carb fits, and also fits into the air box boot with no issues.
LongDistanceRider said:
The 450 tensioning blade fits in a holder and can be replaced w/o splitting the case, 400 engines require case splitting. No need to replace the tensioner itself unless it's sticking instead of sliding.
Click to expand...
The timing chain was already tired and making some noise before the tensioner broke, the noise reduced after I did the maintenance on the tensioner, but did not go away, so that's why I already had a new tensioner, guide and timing chain at home, I had already talked to the mechanic to get the price and everything. If I recall correctly the parts arrived on Friday, the bike broke down on Sunday (I understood the gravity of the situation, so I barely rode the bike, only rode it on Sunday as I had to visit my girlfriend and meet a couple of her friends I hadn't met yet, and I won't lie, this old lady is a huge part of me at this point).

Well, my mechanic came to picked up the bike yesterday, and by today 10AM the engine already had its head out and my mechanic reached out to me with his findings and a video... So I immediately got up and went there to visit myself, had to see it with my own eyes (went there on my 66cc 2 stroke motorized bike, nonetheless, Little Serene still hasn't let me down).

- Sh#@ ton of glue on all gaskets. Even as a small-time mechanic, it annoyed the hell out of me. I even managed to pull a "thread" of silicone that was around the cylinder liner, very VERY close to the pistons (which were at TDC). Jesus... Bad sign.

- Lots of carbon on the pistons and head as well, which I kind of expected since the carbs were pretty bad and the bike did some pops and bangs (even if running fine).

- The valves hit the pistons. Not too hard, not too much, but enough that I don't feel good about it. One of the pistons have very light marks that seem like they barely made it past the carbon, the other one has some deeper marks... You'll see in the pics below.

- Bottom end will be checked in the following days.

My mechanic immediately told me to take it to another shop that does this kind of repair in the 1st message he sent me (we call them "rectifiers" around here and I can't find the translation, but basically the places that do metal work, check for correct tolerances, milling and that sort of stuff, same sort of place that I took my carburetors to, but specialized in engines) - My mechanic also gave me the option to mount it "as is" as I had told him the engine wasn't smoking, but he did not recommend it.

I decided to go for it, and if needed, bottom end will go through the same treatment.

Pretty expensive repair job. Around $300 on top of the $140 of labor that I'm paying to split the cases and replace timing chain, guides and tensioner (might not look like much to you guys, but dollar is worth a lot compared to my local currency, $300 is basically minimum wage for a 5-day per week, 8h/day job, I'm privileged to work on a decent job from an european company so I'm able to do this sort of stuff)...

But hell yeah, I'm going to do it. I don't regret buying this bike yet, I only regret paying what I paid for it, but I already fell in love with it and if I didn't go this route, I'm sure I'd regret later down the line not doing everything in my power to make it run as good as it can. She treated me very well and fed me so many smiles when she was running that I just feel like I need to do the same for her.

Another thing I checked is that the pistons have "MR4" written on them, which means that they should at least be Honda pistons. And according to info I found, they should be STD or 0.25mm (even if my mechanic told me that engine has gone through a rectifier before) I found some other pistons from Honda that had "KK9" instead of MR4 written on them, seem to be produced later down the line. Maybe my pistons are CBR450SR pistons (sport bike version, same engine, only difference being the head cap)

Now, for the pics - Sorry for the quality, I did not take any pics myself, these are all from the video they sent me before I went there;

https://imgur.com/a/HpgAUVI

Now, I wait. I expect at least 2 weeks of waiting, which should at least help me turn the month on my credit card.
 
Last edited:
Another thing I'm going to be doing: buying new spark plugs.
Since the carbs were restored to original without the bike over there, they have not messed with the mixture. They synced the carbs but as far as I know, you gotta sync them on the bike as the cylinders might be slightly different, but since it's all going to be rebuilt and probably going to go to the next oversized step, they should have the same compression.
However, the mixture of the carbs does worry me, so I'm going to put new spark plugs on it to verify and get the mixture right. Just need to figure out if I can check the mixture the same way I check on 2 strokes.
 
Last edited:
CB450DX said:
Another thing I'm going to be doing: buying new spark plugs.
Since the carbs were restored to original without the bike over there, they have not messed with the mixture. They synced the carbs but as far as I know, you gotta sync them on the bike as the cylinders might be slightly different, but since it's all going to be rebuilt and probably going to go to the next oversized step, they should have the same compression.
However, the mixture of the carbs does worry me, so I'm going to put new spark plugs on it to verify and get the mixture right. Just need to figure out if I can check the mixture the same way I check on 2 strokes.
Click to expand...
Mixture is easy. After the carbs a re sync'd simply set idle speed to 1200, pick a carb and adjust for highest idle speed. Might need to reset the idle speed if it creeps over 1300. Repeat on second carb, ride a few miles and reset again. Done.
 
Boosted said:
This photo concerns me :

https://imgur.com/wlWIPnC
Click to expand...
That was before it was restored, if you look further, you can see they welded it beautifully and put a brand new needle seat on. Looks mint now.

LongDistanceRider said:
Mixture is easy. After the carbs a re sync'd simply set idle speed to 1200, pick a carb and adjust for highest idle speed. Might need to reset the idle speed if it creeps over 1300. Repeat on second carb, ride a few miles and reset again. Done.
Click to expand...
When you say "resetting the idle speed" you mean turning it (back, in case it creeps over 1300) till it reaches 1200rpm? Please do tell me more.
If I got it right, I should set the Idle to 1200, then mess with the mixture until it's at the highest RPM it'll go (with no throttle), and then I turn the idle screw back till it's at 1200~1300? Let me know if I got it wrong.

I'll still feel better checking the plugs to see how it's going so I'll still buy new ones (super cheap anyway). I'll put them in after I set the mixture though to make sure, the ones on it should have like... less than 200kms anyway.
 
Last edited:
CB450DX said:
When you say "resetting the idle speed" you mean turning it (back, in case it creeps over 1300) till it reaches 1200rpm? Please do tell me more.
If I got it right, I should set the Idle to 1200, then mess with the mixture until it's at the highest RPM it'll go (with no throttle), and then I turn the idle screw back till it's at 1200~1300? Let me know if I got it wrong.
Click to expand...
You got it right there. The resetting of the idle speed may not be necessary, after 1300 the throttle plate is open far enough that the 1st transition port can start passing fuel. Obviously trying to set mixture with one port while another is free to pass fuel mix won't work well.
Here's the idle circuit so you can see how it functions
Carbcut.jpg
 
LongDistanceRider said:
You got it right there. The resetting of the idle speed may not be necessary, after 1300 the throttle plate is open far enough that the 1st transition port can start passing fuel. Obviously trying to set mixture with one port while another is free to pass fuel mix won't work well.
Here's the idle circuit so you can see how it functions
Click to expand...
Thanks a lot! I've been slacking off on adding a fuel filter as well and have been only using the stock one that comes with the tank, I'll be sure to add a paper filter as well as soon as I get the bike (I got like 5+ filters here that I keep for my motorized bike, which never really needed one since nowadays I use a very nice custom plastic tank).
 
CB450DX said:
I've been slacking off on adding a fuel filter and have only been using the stock one that comes with the tank
Click to expand...
I see a massive sediment bowl at the bottom of the tank's petcock !
..So, you've been using 2 "filters"... ..the sediment bowl along with the fine-mesh filter screen tube inside of the tank.
No need to plumb an inline filter into that 100mm-long gas line between tank and rack of carbs - just check (and clean if necessary) your sediment bowl occasionally...
 
Boosted said:
I see a massive sediment bowl at the bottom of the tank's petcock !
..So, you've been using 2 "filters"... ..the sediment bowl along with the fine-mesh filter screen tube inside of the tank.
No need to plumb an inline filter into that 100mm-long gas line between tank and rack of carbs - just check (and clean if necessary) your sediment bowl occasionally...
Click to expand...
LongDistanceRider said:
I have run for tens of thousands of miles relying solely on the petcock filter, not even a sediment bowl like you have.
Click to expand...
Thanks for letting me know!

It's all 100% clean, I took the petcock out of the tank when it was sent to get painted and rebuilt the whole thing with a repair kit, so it has new o-rings and new mesh filter. Oiled it all up with Motul 710 (2 stroke oil) as well, not a single drop or anything of the sorts. The tank does have a little bit of rust though, but I did clean it (and scratched it while doing so, which was the reason I sent the tank to be painted) -

I'm also working on getting its original tank float restored, since I already convinced myself other ones won't work (tried an reproduction one, no luck, tried the CBX200 one, no luck as well, only other option I saw was the CBX750F one, but I'm not really sure if that'd work, and its cost is a bit high. I already replaced the coil on my original one, so all that should be needed is to weld the 2 wires on it, mount the "arm"on it and put it on the tank. I just want to get the bike running before that though. I know the panel is working fine because when I took out the original one (which had black tar all over its coil, weird stuff), if I moved it just right where it made contact, the panel worked alright - And the CBX200 one also makes the pin move but it didn't sit too well inside the tank I believe, because when installed, it just shows a full tank all the time, I might also try bending that one when I have the time, this stuff is just janky and by reading reviews from the 80's, people noted that it wasn't too precise even back then. Open to suggestions (other than just using the trip meter) if you guys got any tips
 
News! And of course, pictures!
I picked up my cylinder and head from the machine shop (I guess this is what they're called? Still not sure). Here's what was done:

- Cylinder was bored out to 0.75 and honed (and damn the hone on it looks awesome). Making it a 456.08cc now.
- All new valves from MAHLE (also known as Metal Leve around here) - As far as I know, best brand possible around here.
- All new valve retainer/seals - The exhaust ones are Honda, the admission ones are OEM. Good enough.
- Valve honing/lapping and etcetera.
- Cleaned up the whole thing, especially the gasket-sealing parts, messed up the paint a little bit as well. However, there was still glue on EVERY FREAKING HOLE. That I promptly removed with a plastic scraper and a metalic tweezer. I also took out a good amount of dirt from the fins and that opening in the middle of the cylinder where the top screws go through.
- I got a little bit of a discount as they did not have to plain the head or the cylinder, they measured it and both were perfectly straight (thank god)

- New RIK pistons + rings
Now, this was the part I didn't like too much. I confirmed with my mechanic and he put his name on the line for the brand and reported that he built more than 5 with these pistons with no issues, but me, personally, I'd rather put some KMP pistons on it.

However, I only found STD or 1.0mm KMP pistons for this bike, I found some Honda ones as well but they looked pretty bad (even if still new). I also found some "Inago" japanese pistons that looked good but I never heard of this brand before and a Google search got me nothing (other than DT200R pistons from the same brand being sold)
But it's fine I believe, I inspected the pistons and they look fairly decent, I fitted them onto the cylinder with no rings and they were a very, very nice fit, coming down/up very slowly, good stuff.

I also found some... "Racing" pistons that have some "oil dots" and rings below the actual rings for better oil lubrication, from a brand that boasts about "United States american quality" and I'm sorry to you people from the USA but I don't belive in any of that sh#t.
Here's a pic from them, I'm interested in your guys opinion about it - To me, it'd make a little bit more sense on a 2 stroke, but none to the CB. Price was a bit higher than any other option but not significantly.

https://imgur.com/a/wKwEQDn

Now, for the pics of my cylinder, head and pistons (sorry for the mostly vertical pictures)

https://imgur.com/a/V2zxlNv

And while I was writing this post, I received a video from my mechanic, her first start in god knows how long (yeah, it's spitting oil everywhere, I'm going to change that oil and filter anyway, BUT SHE LIVES!)

https://imgur.com/a/pXwpl5t

And just because I haven't posted any pictures of her yet, here's Little Serene, my 66cc bike, that rode 70kms the day I went to grab everything (I just love her, fully custom, not a single thing on this engine is stock at this point):

https://imgur.com/a/x19KRd3
 
I bring bad news. But an alternative as well.

Unfortunately, it seems like neither Mercado Livre or Shopee (both platforms that are huge around here, most sellers sell on both) ship products to the US.

However, there seems to be an website, "Latinafy" that allows you to import stuff. It seems legit from what I can find (but do your own research as well, please), but there will be import duties and etcetera involved, but considering our local currency isn't worth much, and these bikes sold very well here and parts are still largely available, it might still be financially viable.
If you look here: https://latinafy.com/pages/shop-on-mercado-libre-brazil - It seems you can send them a form about any product sold on Mercado Livre Brazil and they'll get back to you within 1 business day with a way to pay and etcetera, they'll basically buy the product, receive it on their warehouse, then ship it to you internationally. (if you look at the site, you'll see that they support basically every LATAM Mercado Livre/Libre as well, not just the brazilian one)

Now, for finding the pistons, just open up mercadolivre.com.br and search for them, I'll leave a glossary of translated terms so it's easier for you guys, remember to add "CB450" after the terms (or CB400) - Just be mindful that our models might be a little bit different from yours.

If you see listings with "Full" or a little lightning, it means that it's on MercadoLivre's warehouses, and those ship on the same day. Sellers also have a reputation and for items that sell a bit there'll be a review system, pretty much like Amazon.

Piston = Pistão (here's a direct link for that search: https://lista.mercadolivre.com.br/pistão-cb-450#D[A:pistão cb 450] )
Piston rings = Aneis pistão
Cylinder = Cilindro
Cylinder liner = Camisa (which also means shirt, so don't forget the CB450 part lol)
Crankshaft = Virabrequim
Gaskets = Junta (they mostly sell kits, so good idea to search for "Kit de junta CB450")
Retainers/seals = Retentor / Retentores (plural) - might want to add which one you want as well as those generally are sold separately, we even have Viton seals for the crankshaft for example.
Suspension = Suspensão
Intake/Admission boots = Duto ar / Duto admissão / Coletor admissão (will depend on the seller which name he'll use)
Plastics (you'll find mostly unpainted ones) = Plasticos (body parts, side panels, etcetera)
Valves = Valvulas
Screws = Parafusos (same situation as the gaskets one, they usually sell kits, so, "Kit parafusos CB450")
Springs = Molas (valve springs = molas valvula CB450)
Balancing shafts = Balanceiros
Chain = Corrente ("Corrente balanceiro" for the balancing shaft one, just "Corrente" for the wheel one, and "Corrente comando" for the timing/cam chain)
Rectifier = Retificador (the aluminum thing on the side that deals with electricity, I don't even know if that's the right name)
Wiring harness = Chicote (which also means whip, lol)

Let me know if I can help you guys in any other way or if you're looking for anything specific that I haven't mentioned. Glad to help.
 
Last edited:
You can get stuff from Mercado Livre into the US if you message the sellers directly. Usually they are willing to do so.

This reminds me, if you ever need a CDI from me I do know that electronics are taxed ridiculous down there and I'm always interested in Sega Master System stuff. Trades are always possible with my Brasil friends.
 
Hello friends, long time no see. Sorry for taking long to reply, took a vacation with my girl and traveled for a few weeks (on her car, sadly, but great fun nonetheless).
Maraakate said:
You can get stuff from Mercado Livre into the US if you message the sellers directly. Usually they are willing to do so.

This reminds me, if you ever need a CDI from me I do know that electronics are taxed ridiculous down there and I'm always interested in Sega Master System stuff. Trades are always possible with my Brasil friends.
Click to expand...
Not easy to message them directly these days. Only way to open a message directly is to buy an item. You can also send questions but if they have any contact info they'll get flagged and deleted pretty quickly - Although I still think that could be worth a shot. Maybe sneak the contact info on there and it'll be up for long enough that the seller can contact you. MercadoLivre has also started "hiding" the sellers names so even trying to find out who they are and messaging externally has become a bit of a chore.

I will 100% keep your CDI and those coil kits in mind, and telling someone I traded Master System stuff for CB450 parts would be a great story. And as a wise, blue hedgehog once put it: Gotta go fast.

Now, for the bike updates:

Spoiler: It's running great, I missed this thing so much, but read the full story below

I went to the mechanic to pick the bike up. As soon as I arrived there... Issues.

Mechanic basically told me there was probably an issue with the carbs and that I should take it to the machine shop to get them looked at as it was expensive and they'd cover it under warranty. RED FLAG.

But then he asked me why I replaced the pulse/ignition coil and I told him why (out of spec resistance on the secondary coil) - He then told me "get home, put the original coil in, and then test it, if it doesn't work, take the carbs to warranty, if possible, with the bike"
Also told me there was quite a bit of oil on the power chamber so it would probably smoke quite a bit for a while, also said I should come back after 500kms to do some valve service (probably just adjust them, but hey, I won't be paying and it'll have warranty, so I'll take it, less work for me, the interval is probably short because everything is new).

And man, the bike ran like sh#t. Words can't describe how I felt.

Took some LONG cranking to get her started, and it blewback BIG TIME two times making me absolutely deaf for a few seconds.
But eventually started, but it just ran weird as hell at low RPMs. Would idle OK-ish, if a bit low, but everytime I gave it throttle, it'd fire right up normally, but as soon as I let go of the throttle, it'd bog down, and it wasn't the idle.
If I gave it throttle too quick, it'd also bog down and die, sometimes with blowback.

I made it 100m out of the mechanic, died at the first stoplight, stopped the bike, turned the Idle up a bit to try to at least make her not die on me so easily, and it worked. I figured a method for getting home, I swear to god I rode around 3kms with around 1/15 to 3/15 of the throttle, and ALWAYS slowly raising or backing down. If anything, it was a testament to how strong the torque on this engine is.
Got home, removed the tank, took out a sh#t ton of zipties, re-routed new zipties to make the wiring look and feel better (aka not let it touch the head cap), removed the new pulse coil, put a the old original one in, put everything back together,

Key in, ignition on, half a choke, it fired right up. Smoked quite a lot (more than before), but fired RIGHT up, even sounded better. Tested the throttle, all weird movements, didn't bog down or anything... Finally felt some relief.

That was on the 9th of this month, been riding her a little bit here and there ever since. Right now approaching the 100kms mark since the rebuild. (about 70kms away from reaching the 500 mark since I bought her)
Been following the manual on running it in, variating rpms, not taking it over 8000rpms (can't really do that even if I wanted at legal speeds tbh). Some oil has beem smoked on the first few kilometers, but it has completely stopped since I completed it last time, been checking it every day before the 1st ride and after.
The entire bike is just so freaking happy to be running now, and still turns heads wherever I go. Some people still look at me weird when I take my helmet off, probably expecting someone older. I was even asked at a gas station if the bike belonged to my dad or grandfather, not to mention lots of stories I heard from people who owned one back then or just wanted one back then.

When cold, it sometimes blowbacks but very weakly at idle (not loud or anything, and only if I give it 2/15 of the throttle and let it go quickly), never does that when hot and only did that 1 time out on the street.
It also still does some popping when decelarating/engine-braking around 2k~3k rpms. Which is an issue and is probably not good for the run-in period, but man... It sounds sweet.
>I'm pretty sure both of these issues are due to the pulse coil. And maybe the aftermarket silencers, they look like the original, even the exits look to be the exact same diameter but sometimes I have doubts that the Honda ones were so loud after 4k rpms (not obnoxiously loud, though). It really comes alive after that RPM, and I'd be lying if I said I didn't like it)

When I traveled, I closed the petcock, and drained both carburetors, left for 14+ days, came back, opened the petcock, drank a coffee, came back 10 mins later, choke on, fired right up as well. Ran beautifully.

Next steps:

A new "Hitachi" pulse coil has shown up, and I'm studying buying it, looks much better than the chinese crap one I bought before, and being at home and with the bike running, I can test it and give it back and take the money back if it doesn't work out.
I'm also planning on buying a good pulse coil that people have been adapting to the CB, it's a Magnetti Marelli coil from a certain year of the Fiat Fire engine (especifically, the Fiat Uno, the year that uses 2 pulse coils, only need one). Other than having to make an adapter for the cable (since I already got a bad new coil anyway, with a new conector and wires it should be very easy) it should be plug & play and forget. It's going to be super cheap anyway so if it doesn't work, it doesn't work and it's fine, less than $20 spent, little bit more than the price of a good burger. I'll also 3d print a box for it so it's weather-proof, just need to have it on hand to measure it.

I don't plan to replace the original coil with any of them, I'll just test see if the Hitachi/Uno coil works good, and if they do, I'll keep it on the bike below the seat as I do know I'll need a replacement for the original coil one of these days (will probably take months or years, if it ran for 35 years... It'll probably run for at least 1 more, but I'm not counting on it)
I'm keeping an eye if any new "old stock" coil shows up as well (and if push comes to shove I'll be sending @Maraakate an e-mail, same for the CDI)

For this month or start of the next, I plan to rebuild the front suspension with 15w Motul synthetic oil and new retainers/gaskets (super jealous that you guys got air suspension on NA btw), my left side stanchion has been leaking quite a bit, and then stop spending so much money on the bike...
And spend a ton of money on my f#$@ing license for the next few months (which I still haven't got, yeah, been riding illegaly, sorry folks, the license process is the stupidest thing ever in Brazil) at least I know I'll pass the practical exams easily since the bike on the tests is a 150/160 and after riding the CB for so long, CG160's feels like a bicycle to me. I even remember to turn off the turn lights now.
After that, new chain and sprockets, maybe new tires (changing the rear one to a 120/80-18), and I'll finally be able to travel with the bike, which will be another dream realized.

Hope y'all have a great day/night/whatever. I sure am having one, riding this bike on my last few days of vacation.
 
Oh, I forgot to post, I don't believe for a second that the pulse coil is really an Hitachi one, but I already saw one CB450 running with this exact coil and it had absolutely no issues. and also, the crashed CB450 from the junkyard (that I got my superior motor mount from) also had one and the engine was running fine

Interested if you guys know the brand from the logo on the coil; Any info is appreciated.

Here's the two pics that show the logo from the seller:
https://imgur.com/a/0BcBNlo
 
TEC makes a lot of ignition components for Honda. However, is that a real TEC? Could be counterfeit.

Also, this is an ignition coil. As I read the thread before seeing pictures I kept thinking you meant the pickup coil that is mounted under the rotor/flywheel.

Interesting to know what Fiat the coil comes from. Could be worth documenting.

And yes, if the coil is over 1.0ohm on the primary when you measure the yellow and green with a multimeter then it will not work well with these bikes. A lot of the cheap aftermarket ones that happen to fit end up being about 5.0ohm which is way too high and it will cause the bike to die at idle and not run well.
 
Like Frank I was reading this as the pickup coil. All appearances of the new coil says it's real, or someone went to a lot of trouble to duplicate the Hitachi branding on the wires and exact copy of the entire assembly.
 
LongDistanceRider said:
Like Frank I was reading this as the pickup coil. All appearances of the new coil says it's real, or someone went to a lot of trouble to duplicate the Hitachi branding on the wires and exact copy of the entire assembly.
Click to expand...
Counterfeiting is a lot more common down that way because taxes on electronics are ridiculous in Brasil. So, there is a possibility, but if it came off a junkyard bike or from the dealer then...

I am curious what it came from though, any additional source for coils for these is welcome.
 
Sorry about the name! In Brazilian Portuguese it is called "Bobina de Pulso" which would directly translate to Pulse Coil so there's that. Will keep it in mind

Man... I can't believe I didn't recognise that logo, but yeah, it really seems like it's TEC, and that's exactly the one I had seen before on other CBs around here.
That TEC coil (from the picture I posted) is supposedly made in china (going by the importer sticker on its box), and that's about all the info I have on it, other than the fact that it was legitimately imported to Brazil by a well known parts seller. I think I'll bite and buy it.
I had seen coils from TEC on other bikes that were running fine. And tbh, only importing as a person is absolutely terrible in Brazil, if you're a company and can get a container full, it's still bad but not that much.

The bad coil I bought before and removed from the bike only has "CSI-Q03E 11630" laser marked on it, nothing else, no logos or anything of the sorts, but is also shaped like the CB400/450 coil, it fit right, connected normally, and well... Kinda worked, just badly. (And it had 13 reviews, of which 12 were positive, so I might just have been unlucky there to be honest).
I was able to find quite a few ignition coils that look like they could work without issues on AliExpress by searching "CB Ignition Coil" but not really cheap compared to those that were around here.

Oh, and I think I now know why the seller said it was a Hitachi coil instead of a TEC coil. I looked on my bad ignition coil, and the spark plug wires are Hitachi. So the dude might have read that on the wires and thought that the coil was Hitachi as well... smh. Well, at least I got some good extra spark plug wires, coil wires and connector.
 
The "CB ignition coil" will likely be for an SOHC4 or early Honda. And therefore anywhere from 2 to 5 ohm on the primary which won't work with these bikes.
 
Well, a quick update:
The brushes on my starter motor started to go, just did not want to start sometimes. I'd hit it with my rubber hammer, and it would work, took the opportunity to test the relay which was 10/10 as well. Took it to my mechanic with a fully new kit to rebuild the starter motor.
Also, new internal cylinders for the front suspension along with gaskets and retainers and all. Going with 10w Motul oil on it as well, should be ready for pick up tomorrow. Mechanic is kind of disappointed at me that I only rode about 140kms since the rebuild lol.

Now... While looking at some postings online, I found this, a CB 450 with a freaking kickstarter. This intrigues me A LOT as I want it, so freaking much.
1727892998426.png
The small info I was able to gather is all over the place. Posting says it's a Restored 1990 CB 450 DX (just like mine)... But it has the 1988 model year paint, and the engine cover says "Made in Japan" which would point to an older (around 1983?) engine, maybe even a CB 400 side cover (could be a CB 400 engine, but the 400 did not have the radiators, and I don't think they could be easily fitted to them)
When the 450's started being produced here, they did not have the "Made In Japan" on the cover (they removed that once they nationalized the models more), but kept having the round protrusion where the kickstart would be, but it wasn't drilled and I don't think they ever had a 450 with a kickstarter to begin with.

Somewhere along the line (between 81 and 85?) they removed that protrusion, mine doesn't have it, picture on the right shows one that has it:
1727894539939.png

I had read somewhere (maybe even here on VHT) that adding a kickstarter to the 450's wasn't possible... But I'm intrigued right now. Would be very nice to have it. And finding an older/cb 400 side cover shouldn't be that hard....
 
Last edited:
As far as I know from what Jim has mentioned in the past the 450s removed the kickstarter and added a 6th gear/"overdrive" instead. It's possible that this bike you are looking at with the kickstarter doesn't have a 6th gear. I honestly have no idea and information on Brasil export is kind of sparse in the US.

Surprised about the brushes in the starter. I have over 60,000 kilometers on my CM400 and when I took it apart for a rebuild last year the brushes were still pretty decent. I put new ones in anyways since it was apart. And my starter has been used pretty hard. I had a bad CDI more than a decade ago and there was way more cranking than there should have been back in my early days.
 
Maraakate said:
As far as I know from what Jim has mentioned in the past the 450s removed the kickstarter and added a 6th gear/"overdrive" instead. It's possible that this bike you are looking at with the kickstarter doesn't have a 6th gear. I honestly have no idea and information on Brasil export is kind of sparse in the US.

Surprised about the brushes in the starter. I have over 60,000 kilometers on my CM400 and when I took it apart for a rebuild last year the brushes were still pretty decent. I put new ones in anyways since it was apart. And my starter has been used pretty hard. I had a bad CDI more than a decade ago and there was way more cranking than there should have been back in my early days.
Click to expand...
Interesting. The CB 400s around here had a 6th gear and the kickstarter as well... I initially thought they were the same as the CB400N's but it seems like that's not the case... The gearing was changed on the 450's (mainly 1st and 2nd gear, probably because of the 30% increase in torque that also came sooner) but I don't know much more than that. AFAIK the only Brazilian bikes exported were CB 450 DX's to the UK, and not many of them.

On the starter, what I got from the mechanic was that the brushes started to "stick", while researching the issue on Portuguese a couple of people mentioned the same problem.
I'm not surprised as I have no idea the total mileage of this bike (and gave up trying to discover, exhausted all options), but it was working perfectly when it did work, however I did find juust a little of oil (almost a drop) below the starter so that might have something to do with it (or not, there was quite a bit of oil everywhere after they rebuilt the cyl/head, also gotta remember they turned the bike on without the head cap so oil did spill everywhere).
I cranked quite a bit when the engine had issues too so I don't know, at least it wasn't too expensive, less than 13$ for the brushes and acessories, around 20$ for the hours of work. Front suspension ended up being a bit expensive with the new cylinders but it's fine, I just hope it doesn't break down again this month.
 
Well, I picked up the bike today. Starter is great, and damn the front suspension is firm, so much better than before (it was really soft, felt like mattress springs lol), new cylinders also look great on the front of the bike as well. Not to mention that there's absolutely 0 rust spots (before, there were a couple of well-hidden ones).

I also bought a new air filter (foam) that is much closer to original than the one currently on the bike. The one I bought now is very thick and looks exactly like the one in the parts catalog. (the one currently on the bike is about 1/3 or 1/4 of the thickness it should be).
I still feel a bit unsafe about putting oil in it, I'm thinking of ignoring honda instructions (which are to soak it in SAE 90 oil and then twist/press it to get the excess out) and just carefully putting some synthetic 2 stroke oil (motul 710) along its surface. Getting oil out is a b**ch anyway and I want this one to last. I had bought some air filter oil before but I believe the one I bought was very much motocross-oriented and was thick as hell. Ended up throwing the foam away, bike did not like it at all.

The coil also arrived and it's a piece of garbage. I didn't even bother taking it out of the plastic to test its resistance.
It's not TEC at all, and it's from a brand that costs literally 1/3 of what I paid for it. I'm giving it back.

LongDistanceRider said:
This may help https://www.vintagehondatwins.com/forums/index.php?threads/kick-starter-option.158/
Not sure if that kickstarter model in the photo is functional. Looks like the right foot peg will keep it from full rotation.
Click to expand...
I agree with the footpeg part. The support for the footpeg is different between the CB400s and the 450s, the 400 uses a solid one, the 450 uses one that is pretty much open, and triangular in its structure.
(There is also what we call "CB400 Tucunaré" which was only offered for one year, it's a CB450 in everything but the engine, literally, that one doesn't have a kickstart)
 
The oil is actually the filter. By not using oil you are allowing dirt to enter the engine. You don't have to use 90W gear oil, but you can buy the oiling kits at any motorcycle shop. Your mechanic should have it. Avoid the spray on types. You need the ones that you soak the filter in and then wring the excess out and let it set overnight. It makes a difference. If you don't let it sit out and just ride it immediately it will work but will run incredibly rich for a while.

Are they all foam filters originally on the CB450DX? I assumed it was a paper filter? If it is a paper filter normally then I would just switch back to that because practically nobody ever maintains cleaning and oiling foam filters.
 
Maraakate said:
The oil is actually the filter. By not using oil you are allowing dirt to enter the engine. You don't have to use 90W gear oil, but you can buy the oiling kits at any motorcycle shop. Your mechanic should have it. Avoid the spray on types. You need the ones that you soak the filter in and then wring the excess out and let it set overnight. It makes a difference. If you don't let it sit out and just ride it immediately it will work but will run incredibly rich for a while.

Are they all foam filters originally on the CB450DX? I assumed it was a paper filter? If it is a paper filter normally then I would just switch back to that because practically nobody ever maintains cleaning and oiling foam filters.
Click to expand...
Nice to know.
And yep, as far as I know, all foam filters.
The CBR 450 SR has a different filter though that looks to be a paper one (to be fair, almost everything, other than the engine, is different, engine head cap is also different, might have a more agressive cam too, but I'm not sure about that).
On the CB 450 DX, it has a mesh screen (not depicted on the parts catalog it seems) just after the boots that go to the carb, then, on the air box, it has another iron mesh, then the foam and the support for it, with the plastic cap with intake holes above it

Another fun fact: when I bought the bike, one of the two intake holes on the cap was taped shut, I removed the tape... Nothing changed, didn't run better or worse.

Also, I got a question about the air box:

Is it supposed to have a hole on its lowest point (just above the oil/battery vent box)? I'm not sure if it's supposed to have a cap or something, I found the hole when I was cleaning it (and it was a blessing as the box itself was very dirty when I bought it, and I made the dirt fall through there), the hole leads directly to the swingarm, but I think that MAYBE it should be plugged since with the filters and everything, in my mind, air is going to come from the place with the least resistance and since that hole has no filters, it would breathe quite a bit through there...

Here's the part catalog for the air filter:
1727989224534.png
 
Wow, that air box filter arrangement is only found on the 1978/79 US CB400T models and early non US market.
Snorkel was blocked by the PO in an effort to richen the mixture, should have caused problems after @6K rpm.
The bottom of the air box should have items 10-13 attached to the bottom of it with 1-2 hoses, #14, attached as drains. The drain hoses should drop thru the holder on the right side of the center stand pivot
201_3989.JPG
 
If those hoses or plugs are missing it is not fatal. Just to note that those plugs are a US specific things on the CB400s. If you look at Canada and UK for those years there is no plugs. So if they're missing it's not going to hurt anything.
 
I just checked on CMSNL.com there is no plugs for CB450DX. So yeah, those plugs are totally an appeasement to US emissions stuff in the late 70s-early 80s.
 
LongDistanceRider said:
Wow, that air box filter arrangement is only found on the 1978/79 US CB400T models and early non US market.
Snorkel was blocked by the PO in an effort to richen the mixture, should have caused problems after @6K rpm.
Click to expand...
Well, around here, I'm 95% sure it was the same exact one until 1994, when production stopped.
I barely rode the bike before removing the tape so I don't know, literally took her home (around 1/2kms) and took it all apart.

I was talking about this hole over here (pic from the internet):
1728002323481.png
Super useful, got most of the dirt out through it, but still does not make much sense to me, I mean... Air WILL come through there as there won't be much resistance (compared to the snorkels), and also, it's directly above the swingarm, close to the rear tire, so it could easily have dirt or "stuff" close by, but maybe I'm just being too overcautious.

My bike has the oil drain to that little box, one of the mesh screens are still good, the other one disintegrated and I found its pieces. The battery vent and its hose doesn't exist anymore (thankfully).
Still makes no sense
 
Also, here's the .pdf file of the parts catalog if you guys are interested. It has everything for the CB450DX and also the CB450P (the Police model).

CB450DX (and Police) Parts Catalog PT-BR.pdf

drive.google.com drive.google.com

Also, one of the reflectors from the front suspension fell off, they weren't really CB 450 ones as they had 2 screw holes (with screws literally glued to them... ffs).

And THIS, gentlemen, is the first g#d damn part I can't find anywhere. Can easily find round ones from the CB 400's but none for the 450...
There were reproductions around 2 years ago, but it's sold out everywhere.
I found some Ducati (Multistrada, Monster, Diavel, Panigale) ones that look like they MAYBE could fit nicely, and also the Himalayan (pre-2020) ones, which are smaller but could work (the ones after 2020 can also work, but they're round). Both are so freaking expensive though. Thinking of just putting some orange 3M reflective tape on it and search on aliexpress for some good ones (that will take anywhere from 2 weeks to 2 months to arrive, if I find them)
 
Last edited:
CB450DX said:
Well, around here, I'm 95% sure it was the same exact one until 1994, when production stopped.
I barely rode the bike before removing the tape so I don't know, literally took her home (around 1/2kms) and took it all apart.

I was talking about this hole over here (pic from the internet):
View attachment 37778
Super useful, got most of the dirt out through it, but still does not make much sense to me, I mean... Air WILL come through there as there won't be much resistance (compared to the snorkels), and also, it's directly above the swingarm, close to the rear tire, so it could easily have dirt or "stuff" close by, but maybe I'm just being too overcautious.

My bike has the oil drain to that little box, one of the mesh screens are still good, the other one disintegrated and I found its pieces. The battery vent and its hose doesn't exist anymore (thankfully).
Still makes no sense
Click to expand...
That hole at the bottom is probably for one of the drains. Yeah, those element separators are always garbage. You can safely ignore this entire blowby recirculation system. It was a total emissions thing and won't cause any issues if you just let it drain to the atmosphere.
 
CB450DX said:
Also, here's the .pdf file of the parts catalog if you guys are interested. It has everything for the CB450DX and also the CB450P (the Police model).

CB450DX (and Police) Parts Catalog PT-BR.pdf

drive.google.com drive.google.com

Also, one of the reflectors from the front suspension fell off, they weren't really CB 450 ones as they had 2 screw holes (with screws literally glued to them... ffs).

And THIS, gentlemen, is the first g#d damn part I can't find anywhere. Can easily find round ones from the CB 400's but none for the 450...
There were reproductions around 2 years ago, but it's sold out everywhere.
I found some Ducati (Multistrada, Monster, Diavel, Panigale) ones that look like they MAYBE could fit nicely, and also the Himalayan (pre-2020) ones, which are smaller but could work (the ones after 2020 can also work, but they're round). Both are so freaking expensive though. Thinking of just putting some orange 3M reflective tape on it and search on aliexpress for some good ones (that will take anywhere from 2 weeks to 2 months to arrive, if I find them)
Click to expand...
Nice! You can go here for NOS parts and also it's clickable, more interactive, might be easier to find stuff: https://www.cmsnl.com/honda-cb450dx-1988-1993-brasil_model49481/partslist/
 
Ahh yeah, you're talking about part number 33741-443-720. You'll have a hard time finding it because it's unique to the CB450DX according to CMSNL when you check "part fitment". This means you're going to have to check Mercado Livre or junk yard for a used fork assembly to find it.

I did notice 33741 is a general starting part number for reflectors for Honda. You may be able to use this on CMSNL to search for others to see if they look similar. You won't get size dimensions though... https://www.cmsnl.com/search/?section=all&q=33741-&tab=
 
Maraakate said:
That hole at the bottom is probably for one of the drains. Yeah, those element separators are always garbage. You can safely ignore this entire blowby recirculation system. It was a total emissions thing and won't cause any issues if you just let it drain to the atmosphere.
Click to expand...
A part of me thought that it would be funny to route the carbs drain to that hole but I don't want stuff to catch fire (not easily at least), and the CB has some pretty good routing spots for the hoses coming down from the carbs to sit as well, so I'm not doing it. I'll probably just put some electrical tape under the hole so air doesn't come through there and that's it.
Maraakate said:
Ahh yeah, you're talking about part number 33741-443-720. You'll have a hard time finding it because it's unique to the CB450DX according to CMSNL when you check "part fitment". This means you're going to have to check Mercado Livre or junk yard for a used fork assembly to find it.

I did notice 33741 is a general starting part number for reflectors for Honda. You may be able to use this on CMSNL to search for others to see if they look similar. You won't get size dimensions though... https://www.cmsnl.com/search/?section=all&q=33741-&tab=
Click to expand...
I searched through the entirety of Mercado Livre... I looked around for that part number as well... Nothing... Just nothing. Searched on local parts store, nothing as well. A guy mentioned just using 3M reflective tape and posted a pic of his bike's front, the sticker looks decent (and it's about the only part that looks good of the entire picture... CBR 450 SR front wheel for some reason? That brake bracket doesn't look stock, but might be, since the CBR fairings cover a good part of it... I don't know what's this... May just be a naked CBR450 SR).


1728007233728.png
 
Well, the parts arrived. And I have a (yet, another) new issue.

First, here's more info about Fiat's ignition coil, I started working on it, but haven't tested it yet:

The ignition coil is a Fiat Uno/Palio/Tempra/(other cars as well probably) from 1993/1994 (although they were used until 2000 on other cars, but I bought the ones for 93/94) - Those engines used 2 ignition coils (each supplying 2 cylinders) which is what makes them compatible, these are from before Fiat started deploying the Fire engine.

Here's a pic of it, along with the conector/wires it uses (btw this connector is really nicely weatherproofed, I'll give it that)
1728241914594.png
First of all: I tried to test them with my multimeter to read the resistances to try to sort of compare them to the CB's original one, just couldn't, nothing came up. Weird.

You'll need the spark plug wires and the connector and its wires for the Fiat coil. Easily found around here as well.
I ended up buying some random spark plug wires, tested them at 2.5k ohms resistance with their included terminal, a little bit below the CB's original one (that uses spark plug terminals of 5k ohm), but I gather it should be fine. As far as I was able to learn, resistored spark plug terminals were created to try not to mess with AM radio, and who cares about that stuff nowadays. If needed, I can just put the CB's terminals on them as well. XD05Fs are easily found around here, or I can just use mine currently on the bike anyway.

They also use 2 wires, you need to adapt the conector (easily done with a bad CB coil, just take out the metal tabs from the connector [you'll need to press down on a tab which keeps them from getting out] and put new wires on the metal tabs, assemble the conector again, done.
Just make sure you know which one is the positive. The Fiat wires use the red as the positive, so you connect it to the yellow CB one. On the Fiat coil, the Blue wire is negative, so connect it to the green. (at least these are the colors that come in my brazilian one, it is recommended to test to figure out which one is the positive/negative on the CBs).

Other than that, that coil will still need to be grounded to the frame, so you'll need to fabricate 2 metal sheets/plates, or at least, for testing purposes, wire. I'm making two metal plates that position the fiat coil just a little bit below the original coil, the Fiat coils have holes to attach a screw, but they're much smaller than the CB holes in the frame, I'm going to attach it to the sheets by just using a screw and a nut. Right now, I'm waiting on a friend of mine that will weld the wires to the metal tabs to make the new connectors (you don't need to weld, they have tabs to put pressure on the wires, but I really want this to be as safe/strong as it can, and this said friend is great with welding small stuff, worked with him repairing computer for years)

I should get everything done this week, will test it with wires before fabricating the plates for the coil as well, I need to know if it'll work out. Everyone I saw also just did small plates and kept the coil under the tank with no weather protection other than that, but I'll still probably print a small 3D box for it.

I saw more than 5 people on YouTube teaching how to go about it, also mentioning sparks felt better, bike started easier, the usual stuff, could just be placebo anyway. Lots of others talking about the same adaptation on Facebook groups as well, some mentioning the coils being on their bike for more than 5 years. Only negatives I found were from people who didn't manage to make it work (probably didn't check negative/positive and maybe fried the coil?) and another guy mentioning it only lasted 3 years (even if so, these things cost less than $10 over here, I recently found out that there also are NGK ones that cost $15~20, but for now I'll stick to Magneti Marelli)

Other than that... A new issue. Help.
First things first: I still haven't set the mixture, I'll work on that today. But I think that only affects the idle, so I don't think it could be related (not entirely sure about it only affecting the idle).
I'm gonna call the issue "second stage" because it very much feels like that, kind of like when a 2 stroke hits the powerband. It feels to me like it may be the diaphragm, but I'm not entirely sure of that as well. I need to learn more about these carburetors.

It feels like the engine is a bit lazy, maybe the carbs are taking a bit to open the "second stage" (in my mind, maybe that's the diaphragm?)
When the bike reaches around ~5300/5700 RPMs it feels like the second stage opens (I feel like this is the diaphragm) and the bike just GOES, shoots, goes fast as hell. And I notice this doesn't happen when I don't give it a lot of throttle (which I find pretty great for controlling the bike, but I'm not sure if that's normal)

However, what I noticed now is that:
Sometimes, on 3rd/4th gear, even if I give it full throttle or 3/4 throttle it just doesn't go, it arrives at around 5000~5300RPM and stays there, like it's almost out of breath/torque.
But also, sometimes it stays there, and all of a sudden after a couple of seconds it just freaking GOES, like it finally got what it wanted from the carbs (in my mind, that's when the diaphragm finally goes up and it gets more gas, and just rips)

This doesn't happen in 2nd gear (to be fair, I only tested it once or twice, I feel like a jackass making all that much noise and going that slow)... I think that the air/gas mixture that the carbs give the engine on 2nd gear is enough to get it closer to 6k rpm and then it maybe opens easier, so maybe the second stage/diaphragms are just opening later than they should. As the carburetor was also re-built and rectified recently, that might have something to do with it, maybe it also needs to break-in a little bit.

It took me a long time to notice this as I'm not taking it to the high rpms often at all, mostly between 3 and 5k most of the time, after 200kms breaking in the new hone on the cylinder, new piston and rings etc, I have just started every now and then doing some short pulls (I'm still keeping it below 8000rpm as the manual says) and I noticed this happening.

The air box has also been working with a foam that is much less denser and much less thick than the original oil, also had no oil, so air pressure could've maybe influenced it. I already put oil on the new filter, wrung the excess out and I'm letting it sit for a bit before putting it on the bike (following @Marakatee 's instructions)
I also added 10 mls of 2 stroke oil to the tank (it was full, so less than 1ml per liter, almost nothing, I'm using Motul 710, fully synthetic, smokeless, etc, good stuff, should also help with the fact that my gas has freaking 25% of ethanol, I'm only running 102 RON (octane) premium gas on the bike as well)

I'll report back as soon as I do the stuff I need to do and test it out. Please let me know if you guys have any suggestions, especially on this new issue.

I told myself that this bike was not a project. And man, what a project it's been.
Despite all of this, these last 520kms (what I rode since I bought it) were some of the best I've ever ridden, I love this little twin to death, from it's rumble to its character and even how it looks. I can't get enough of it. I'm speedrunning through my license course so I can ride it further than my neighborhood without being paranoid, so freaking excited for that.
 
Good progress.(y)
The carbs don't have a second stage, they are CV, constant velocity, design. What you're describing with the sudden power surge over 5K is typically the CDI or the stator. Need to test those. It sounds like the timing advance is holding retarded until you get enough rpm to generate a strong enough signal to make it advance.
 
CB450DX said:
As far as I was able to learn, resistored spark plug terminals were created to try not to mess with AM radio, and who cares about that stuff nowadays.
Click to expand...
Only those who listen to sports/talk shows here in America :ROFLMAO: And many if not most of them are also on FM radio now too.
CB450DX said:
but for now I'll stick to Magneti Marelli)
Click to expand...
They must be good quality as a brand, lots of drag racers use their magnetos
CB450DX said:
should also help with the fact that my gas has freaking 25% of ethanol
Click to expand...
Wow, we hate having only about 10%. Do you have a product like Sta-Bil available? https://www.goldeagle.com/brands/sta-bil/
CB450DX said:
I told myself that this bike was not a project. And man, what a project it's been.
Click to expand...
LOL, they can certainly become more than you expect, and in a hurry sometimes too.
 
You mentioned resistance of plug wires. This means you are using carbon wires. Don't do this, get solid core wires because the automotive wires degrade from constant UV exposure in about a year or two and your bike will start running funny.

What is the primary resistance of that coil? You can measure it by putting a multimeter across the two-pin plug DISCONNECTED FROM CDI.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top Bottom